Insights from Medical Medium Marie Miller

Marie Miller, a medical medium and theta healing instructor based near Columbus, Ohio, shares her fascinating journey into the spiritual and healing realms. Her experiences began after a near-death experience as a child, which opened her perception to the spirit world. Growing up in a small town of 250 people, she often sensed when someone had passed away before others knew, a skill she credits to her natural connection with the unseen. Her childhood was enriched by the presence of her grandmother’s spirit, a relationship she didn’t realize was extraordinary until later conversations with her mother.

Marie began encountering a wider variety of spiritual phenomena as her abilities evolved. For Marie, every challenge presents a valuable lesson, and she believes that life’s difficulties often arise to teach us virtues or help us grow in unexpected ways.

Marie’s path led her to energy healing after discovering her sensitivity to Western medicine. As a medical medium, she uses theta healing to connect with a person’s body on a deep level, identifying the root causes of physical and emotional ailments. Unlike traditional medicine, which often treats symptoms, Marie focuses on uncovering unresolved traumas and emotions that manifest as disease. Through guided meditation and a theta brainwave state, she helps clients release stuck energy and facilitates their natural healing processes.

Marie emphasizes the transformative power of self-discovery in healing. Rather than simply providing answers, she guides clients to uncover their subconscious beliefs, fostering deeper, more lasting change. She believes understanding the subconscious is key to addressing life’s challenges and that anyone can learn these techniques with practice. Teaching theta healing is a significant part of her work, and she finds joy in empowering others to heal themselves, often working herself out of a job in the process.

Her insights into theta healing draw on ancient practices, modern techniques, and her unique life experiences. She explains that achieving a theta brainwave state, once a lengthy process for our ancestors, can now be learned quickly with proper training

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Transcript

[00:00:00] Marie: For every negative experience and every negative belief that we form, there's something really cool that we're learning too. As part of our spiritual progression, our big test or initiation is to understand that as long as we connect to our higher power, whatever that is our source, we  have nothing to fear.

Jill:[00:00:16] Welcome back to seeing death clearly. I'm your host, Jill McClennen, a death doula and end of life coach. Here on my show, I have conversations with guests that explore the topics of death, dying, grief, and life itself. My goal is to create a space where you can challenge the ideas you might already have about these subjects.

[00:00:36] I want to encourage you to open your mind and consider perspectives beyond what you may currently believe to be true. In this episode, Marie Miller is a medical medium and Theta healing instructor shares her journey into the spiritual and healing realms. After a childhood near death experience opened her perception to the spirit world, Marie discovered her unique ability.

[00:00:59] Her path has been shaped by encounters with ghosts, mastering energy healing techniques, and overcoming challenges that taught her the transformative power of life's lessons. As a medical medium, Marie uses theta healing to uncover the root causes of physical and emotional ailments, helping clients release unresolved traumas and foster natural healing.

[00:01:20] Join us as Marie demystifies these practices, blending ancient wisdom with modern techniques, and inspires us to embrace self discovery for profound transformation. Thank you for joining us for this conversation. Welcome, Marie, to the podcast. Thank you so much for coming on today. Can you just start us off?

[00:01:39] Tell us a little bit about yourself, where you're from, anything that you want to share. 

[00:01:43] Marie: Hi, Jo, thanks for having me. My name's Marie. I live near Columbus, Ohio. I am a medical medium, a healing instructor, psychic, and I've been seeing ghosts since I had a near death experience when I was a kid. 

[00:01:55] Jill: All right.

[00:01:55] That's interesting. Medical medium. Love it. So yeah, I got probably lots I'm going to end up asking you along the way. So actually, why don't you just start us from the beginning? I want to hear about your near death experience because you had one when you were a child and then after that you were seeing ghosts.

[00:02:13] Tell me about that. 

[00:02:14] Marie: Yeah, it's interesting because I actually didn't know it had happened until much later in life because I was young enough, I wasn't even forming conscious memories. I was two and a half, I was playing in the front yard or in the driveway and dad was going to go run some errands. And somehow I got under the wheel of the car.

[00:02:32] My mother was behind the garage, shelling some walnuts. So it's definitely in the fall. She got a vision from God that I was in trouble, ran out and stopped the car when the wheel was on my chest. So there was a pause there. And in that pause, I actually did die. Like everything crunched and I was above my body.

[00:02:49] And there was this, just to see this, this decision, a little bit of anger of like, I'm not going out like this. My mom convinced my dad to throw the car in reverse. Cause there was some damage, right? Like the damage from when the car got to here was all repaired when I decided I was going to stay. And my body repaired itself.

[00:03:06] Then when he was reversing off of me, there was a little bit of damage to the right kidney and to the right side of my body. They took me to the emergency room and this is probably, and I learned this is later why I didn't trust gaslit my mom to be like, there's nothing wrong with her. And like, gave her a hard time for bringing me in.

[00:03:26] Cause there was like, To them, there's obviously nothing wrong. They thought she was overreacting, but I had just been run over by a car. 

[00:03:31] Jill: How could you bring a child to the emergency room that had been run over by a car and then be like, Oh no, they're fine. Like there's nothing wrong. That's crazy. 

[00:03:39] Marie: Yeah, 

[00:03:40] Jill: it 

[00:03:40] Marie: was.

[00:03:41] And I guess they were just like, Oh, kids bounce back so easily. She's fine. But it was honestly, because there was that moment where I got knitted back together, because when you decide to come back in. Spirit is going to fix you so you can enjoy life. 

[00:03:56] Jill: And then, from that moment, you started to see other spirits wandering around.

[00:04:03] Thankfully, because you were so young, you probably didn't have Like, I feel like if that happened to me today, I would probably be terrified. If all of a sudden I was like, Oh my gosh, there's people everywhere and I don't want to see them. But when you're young, it was probably kind of like, Oh, this is interesting.

[00:04:18] How did that feel? 

[00:04:19] Marie: These are my friends. My dad's mom spent a lot of time with me at that age. She was always hanging out with me. And I didn't think there's anything nor, you know, weird about it. And also too, I always knew, because I live in a town of 250 people, I always knew when someone died before the rest of the town did.

[00:04:37] Who's next? That was just normal. One thing I'm really grateful for is when I'd say these things to my mom, like, Oh, Cecilia just died. And I'm sitting in the living room. Like, how would I know that? She didn't freak out. Her face would go still when she'd leave the room. Because she also had gifts that she didn't know what to do with.

[00:04:52] She supported me in every way that she could. And the biggest thing was she didn't freak out. That's 

[00:04:56] Jill: amazing because a lot of parents would. And then try to convince you that none of that was real, whatever, and then it just confuses people, and you've got your parents saying that what you're experiencing isn't real, but now I know that this is, because I'm seeing it, I'm experiencing it.

[00:05:14] So it never scared you, you were never freaked out. 

[00:05:17] Marie: No, it was all friendly ghosts until I moved to Santiago, but that's like a whole other story. As a kid, it was all really friendly and nice and pleasant. These were my playmates. 

[00:05:25] Jill: And did you see them just like a normal person? Were they like more see through?

[00:05:31] Because I don't really know. I'm just going off of what I think. I've heard from other people. 

[00:05:36] Marie: Now there's a lot more variety in how I see them. It's anywhere from the room being dark to just a cloud or darkness to actually seeing them. But when I was a kid, I think because maybe my perceptions were different, it was only the really crystal clear ones that I would see.

[00:05:49] Jill: So they just look like a regular person. It 

[00:05:52] Marie: looked like they did. One of the things that clued me into Because I didn't realize this when I was talking to you, they're very real to me. I was talking to my mom later on about my grandma and how much time I spent with her. She was like, okay, first of all, Marie, Grandma Elizabeth was dead by then.

[00:06:08] I'm like, oh cool, I was talking to her ghost. Apparently she wasn't then. Because the version of my Grandma Elizabeth that I hung out with, my ghost, the grandma, actually appeared 

[00:06:16] Jill: to me at her slender wait. When, say, if I was to die now, would my ghost look like I do now? Would it look like I did when I was a teenager?

[00:06:26] Do I have a choice? You do have a choice. I 

[00:06:28] Marie: know when people do what I call their goodbye tour, in the week after someone passes, they visit a bunch of people. They will appear exactly how they were within months of how they died so that you recognize them. But when they cross over and come back and appear, then they can choose their appearance.

[00:06:44] Jill: That is really interesting, because Do sometimes wonder, you know, like when people die, if their ghost come around, like, what if somebody died in a tragic way? It seems like that would be a shame for them to show up in the form that they look like the moment that they died. 

[00:07:03] Marie: No, they're not going to, they, that's why I seen in the last six months how they looked.

[00:07:07] 'cause they're gonna show up in a way that's recent but recognizable. 

[00:07:10] Jill: Do they have a choice? Like, can they choose at that point? Like, well, within the last six months, but I want this day because my hair looked really good that day. Might be most students need to have control 

[00:07:21] Marie: over quench. But I just know that they're not going to show up, like, you know, if it's a horrific accident, they're not going to show up mangled.

[00:07:27] They're going to show up in a way that's comforting and good to you. Because the purpose of the goodbye tour is to say goodbye, to bring comfort, and to have that final moment in that recognizable form before they move off. 

[00:07:38] Jill: I know my great grandmother had one of her granddaughters die. The granddaughter that died, she was the same age as my mom at the time.

[00:07:47] They were in high school. And she died, and my great grandmother barely spoke English, but my grandmother had told me this story so many times, that after Barbara died, she visited. Her grandmother, and stood at the end of her bed and said, Don't cry anymore, Grandma. I'm happy, I feel better, cause she died of cancer at 17.

[00:08:06] My grandma said her mother had just been in bed crying for, I don't know how long. She said all of a sudden one day she was fine. She just said, Oh, you know, Barbara came to see me last night and said, Grandma, don't cry. And so I don't cry anymore. And whatever it was, right? I'm sure there's people that are listening that are like, oh, it's a part that happens in your brain.

[00:08:26] It's figment, imagination, whatever else. Okay, sure. Whatever. Doesn't really matter to me because whatever it did, it gave her peace and comfort and she was able to move on after the death of her grandchild. But I do believe, because I know if it was me, If I were to die, I would do everything I could to come back and visit my children.

[00:08:46] There's, there's a part of me that would be determined that I was not moving on yet, and so I do believe that these things happen even if I don't see it. And my mom says I used to see my grandpa after he died, but I don't remember it. I was little, so maybe when you're young, it's just easier. 

[00:09:02] Marie: It is easier for kids because, you know, they're basically in a theta state and super open and super sensitive till about the age of seven or eight when things start to shift.

[00:09:10] Jill: Okay, yeah, and I was probably about four. Maybe. I remember it in a different way. 

[00:09:15] Marie: We do have all of our memories stored. When you go into the beta brainwave, you can actually get access to those things that are stored differently from before we, on just memories. 

[00:09:25] Jill: I don't know if I would even, not that I wouldn't want to go back and remember it, but it just doesn't seem that important to me.

[00:09:31] Like, whatever, it's fine. All of it's fine. And so. Yeah, I want to hear more too, like, you said when you went to San Diego, you saw some not so nice ones. So I want to hear a little bit about that. 

[00:09:44] Marie: One more thing on the goodbye tour, I had one of my housemates in Oakland, like his uncle had died. And so on the goodbye tour, the uncle appeared to me, he came into the kitchen and I'm like, your uncle was just here and his friends like, Oh yeah, he died.

[00:09:59] And it was just so funny that the goodbye tour went to the sidekick and said the person who knew they. 

[00:10:04] Jill: Yeah, because I guess some people, if they might get the visits, they just can't see the person. Maybe they sense it in a way that might seem weird or unusual, but they're not necessarily going to see a dead loved one's spirit.

[00:10:22] It's fascinating. I love it. 

[00:10:24] Marie: We love it. So with San Diego, there's a few things that happened. I was actually going through a period of expansion. When you're at a certain vibration, you start to see ghosts and perceive things through the fourth plane. They get attracted to you. As a kid, I had one level of ability to see, and then I went through these upgrades.

[00:10:39] I started having to deal with things that were a little bit peskier. The ghost that attached to me when I was working at the Swedenborg hall, I was a technical director for their theater there. And I spent a lot of time just there by myself. It was literally the ghost of the guy who had worked ever previously.

[00:10:55] I went through a lot of having ghosts attached to me for a while. I could tell when there was one, it was really subtle for me where I get really clumsy. And when I was stacking the chairs, I'd bang my fingers in between them and I actually got pushed down the stairs once. This is before I knew how to clear ghosts, because seeing them is one thing and clearing them is another.

[00:11:11] So I went to my psychic, my theater healer at the time, and she cleared them for me, but it kept getting more intense until I was forced to learn how to do it myself. 

[00:11:20] Jill: Because that's what I would really not want. That's, I think, the thing that it would bother me because it impacts your life. It impacts the way that you live your life.

[00:11:28] And that seems like that would be a nuisance. 

[00:11:30] Marie: Well, I've learned that when there's a lesson you need to learn, the universe and your higher self is asking you to learn a lesson that it's going to keep intensifying until you get it. And since then, the understanding I've come to have around ghosts, demons, and things like that, and all these other things from other dimensions that come into our world, is that they're just part of the spiritual ecosystem.

[00:11:50] They're not good or bad. Some exist because people have a contract or vow to fight evil. Then they're like, well, I'm the evil that you need to fight. As part of our spiritual progression, our big test or initiation is to understand that as long as we connect to our higher power, whatever that is, our source, we're We have nothing to fear from these aspects.

[00:12:08] Well, that's good to hear. 

[00:12:09] Jill: It makes sense that there's nothing really good or bad, right? It all just makes up part of life here on this plane, life on other planes. This idea that if we were here to fight against evil, well, then there's going to be the evil that's going to show up for us. I think, you know, there's probably a part of, I know, at least for me, Has been negative, quote, unquote, negative experience that part of me likes.

[00:12:41] It's a weird way of putting it. And I'm trying to think there's a woman, Carolyn Elliott, that wrote a book, and I want to say it was called Spiritual Kink or something. And that was kind of like her idea behind it, in like, that everything negative that happens in our life, there's part of us that kind of likes it, right?

[00:13:00] Like it's a kink for us, right? And so. When I read that book and I started thinking about it, I was like, as much as I hate to admit it, there is part of me that you get a thrill from some of the negative stuff, or when you overcome it, it feels so good to overcome it. There is part of us that likes our negative experiences, even if we don't want to admit it.

[00:13:20] Marie: Absolutely. For every negative experience and every negative belief that we form, there's something really cool that we're learning, too. And that may be why we really like it. So like, Ooh, I went through this intense experience. I wonder what really cool prize I'm getting for getting through this. Like, what is the new virtue I'm developing?

[00:13:37] Or what is this new thing that I'm learning? 

[00:13:39] Jill: I like it almost like a video game. Like you go through the challenges in a video game, you get your prize at the end. But I mean, there is some people that do say that this life is almost like a video game, right? That we program it before we get here as to what we want to experience.

[00:13:56] I don't know. I'm One of those people that I don't really firmly believe anything, but I also don't firmly not believe anything. I'm open to all possibilities and find it all interesting. 

[00:14:10] Marie: It really is. My understanding of how we program our lives. It's that it's not that we pick certain events to happen, it's that we want to learn certain things like we have a list of these are the virtues I want to learn and these are some things I want to do in my life.

[00:14:25] And so you hire yourself and your guides and everyone's like, okay, we'll make that happen. But sometimes negative things happen because we didn't get the lesson the first six times. And so it's going to keep intensifying until you get it. 

[00:14:37] Jill: People say they attract people into their life and they're like, why do I always attract the same people?

[00:14:41] It always turns out the same way. Well, yeah, because you're not learning. You need to learn. So you're going to keep attracting it. We want to blame everybody else. What's wrong with everybody? Well, you're the only common denominator in all of these things. So maybe not that there's anything wrong with us.

[00:14:58] It's just that we're not learning what we needed to learn from the experience. 

[00:15:02] Marie: Yep. And the faster we learn, the faster we get a new experience. I'm not always the fastest learner. I've had the universe bring me some really intense lessons before, especially with me and my trying to find a soulmate. I spent 10, 15 years being mad at the universe for not sending me a soulmate.

[00:15:17] And the creator's like, I sent you six and you dumped them all. That's me. Not allowing love, getting mad at the universe and blaming everyone else, guys are jerks and all these stories, when I was the one refusing love the whole time. That was a really hard pill to swallow when it came to that realization that I had been the block the whole time.

[00:15:35] Jill: And once you realized it, what'd you do? 

[00:15:37] Marie: Fell madly in love with my first guy and moved to Ohio. Once I realized it and shifted it, it was so cool because I'm like, ooh, I got it right the first time. We just needed some time apart. 

[00:15:46] Jill: Yeah. Sometimes that happens too, right? That we need to have some time apart in order to grow and learn and then you come back together and you're like, oh, we're still the same, but we've grown and we've changed and that's not a bad thing either.

[00:16:02] Well, good. I'm glad you. Thank you. He's cute too. Oh, yay. All right. Um, and I want to hear about, you said it was psychic, what do you call it? Psychic medicine? Psychic? Medical medium. There you go. Medical medium. Tell me about that. That sounds really interesting. It's actually why I 

[00:16:20] Marie: got into energy healing to begin with, because when I was in college, I realized I'm allergic to Western medicine, like literally three different types of antibiotics I can't take.

[00:16:29] The system also didn't feel right, but I love viruses, and I always wanted to be in medicine, but that wasn't the way for me to enter Western medicine. As a medical medium, I go into a beta brainwave. Talk to someone's body to figure out what's really going on. A lot of times when you go to your Western medicine doctor, they're going to treat the symptoms within the system that the symptoms are appearing.

[00:16:50] And what I do is I'll be like, where is this really starting? Sometimes the symptoms appear in the nerves, but it's really the stomach that needs help or the intestine. I was talking with someone else where it was showing up in their blood, but I'm like, we need to talk to the endocrine system. And so. I just talked to the body, find out what emotions are stuck and what trauma needs to be resolved.

[00:17:12] And you work through that using theta healing. Once you've released that energy that's created the disease, the body is allowed to heal on its own. 

[00:17:19] Jill: Fascinating. So the idea then that The root of a lot of our illnesses is stored emotions, stored trauma that is coming out in different ways, right? Headaches, stomach aches, muscle pains.

[00:17:35] But really, it's that trapped emotion. Is that kind of the way that you say it? 

[00:17:40] Marie: Yeah, absolutely. The diseases are the, the symptoms keep getting more intense until you, Actually address that original feeling that needs to change. 

[00:17:48] Jill: And with Theta Healing, what exactly is that? Because I kind of know about Theta states, but I don't really know that much about it.

[00:17:57] Marie: The Theta Healing technique is developed by Vianna Stiebel. The basis is we go into a theta brainwave and take the client in with us. We also have a method of discovery or digging, as we call it, to try to help the client find for themselves what the, the issue is. As opposed to me as a psychic just telling you, because I used to do that, but I actually find it's more powerful for my clients to help them understand their brain, understand their subconscious, understand how they got to where they are.

[00:18:26] So. It's a deeper healing when somebody actually says for themselves, Oh my gosh, this is my root cause, when those things come out of their mouth, versus when they hear me say it. Because I've done it both ways and it's night and day how powerful it is. And it also helps the client when they really understand their brain.

[00:18:41] It means in between sessions, they're doing a lot of the work for themselves and eventually they don't need me anymore. Which is, I do work myself out of a job fairly often and I'm happy to do that. 

[00:18:51] Jill: And with getting into this state, that's like a meditation practice. I know sometimes people say when they meditate, that's the state you're getting into.

[00:18:59] Is it guided meditation or how do you typically help people get into that state? 

[00:19:04] Marie: Yeah, it's a guided meditation. We have a set meditation that we use for class and I've actually seen it in other places. It's just a shortcut to get there because a lot of Ancient practices were all about getting into a theta brainwave.

[00:19:16] Alain Lavourlin Dervishes would use it. If you look at a lot of different old rituals, that really was about getting you there. And it took our ancestors sometimes maybe three days to get there. But with training, you can get there in under a minute. Enough training, you can get there kind of instantly.

[00:19:30] Because we go into a theta brainwave every night when we fall asleep in a dream. Other meditations are usually in a deep alpha, which is that state right before you fall asleep. 

[00:19:38] Jill: So then You get people into that state. When they're in that state, are you talking to them to help them figure out what's going on in their body?

[00:19:50] Like, you're kind of like their guide once they're in that state. 

[00:19:53] Marie: It's still a conversation once we're in there, which means sometimes when people get in their head and get kind of mental, I need to reframe them and bring them back in. Because the biggest trick to this, once you get in the beta state, is to stay focused on the feelings in the body and not the logical progression of your disease, because we're in the subconscious, right?

[00:20:10] And so there is a logic to the subconscious that's completely different to the logic when we have our eyes open and we're trying to do math. It's completely different logic. 

[00:20:19] Jill: Yeah, man, for sure. Cause I'm a very in my head kind of person sometimes and I practice meditation. I practice shamanic journeying.

[00:20:28] I practice things to help me kind of get out of that. And then that's when sometimes I'll find myself getting to a different state and then my brain will snap right in and be like, Hey, don't forget about me. All right, sure. You're still there, but can't forget. It's a practice and maybe I will never get there in this lifetime.

[00:20:47] And that's okay too. Um, Trying to let go of all expectations, but have you ever done this type of healing with somebody that you're kind of like, all right, they're dying, they're too far gone, they're too far past a process that you're not able to actually work with them and bring them to a state of healing.

[00:21:09] Eventually our bodies are going to have to die, right? No matter how much we work on healing, eventually the body will die. There's really nothing that will stop that. So what's that like for you? It's actually 

[00:21:20] Marie: quite beautiful, because whether or not someone heals is really up to them. And for some people, it really is about getting them out of pain and getting them comfortable.

[00:21:29] So they can make that transition easily. It doesn't have to be dramatic. I've done a lot more of that with pets than with humans. I've watched a lot of pets crossover, which also involves working with the humans, because the humans are always like, what do I do? I'll walk the pet over and we don't have to do anything else.

[00:21:46] So, because not everybody wants to put their cat pet down. Oftentimes, if they've been working with me, they don't need to be put down. They can cross over easily. Same with humans. I've worked with a lot of people in comas, which is fascinating. Yeah. Because they're in a delta brainwave. A lot of comas that happen naturally are about people not, they're kind of frozen and they don't know if they want to stay or go.

[00:22:06] It's about talking to their higher self and making it safe for them to make the decision for themselves. Are you going to come back, get back in your body, and like do this thing and be human, or are you going to move on to your next thing? And then you sort of help them back into their body enough to make the decision, and then wait and you see.

[00:22:22] Jill: And so, they're in the coma, so they're not speaking, the eyes aren't open, are you speaking to them out loud at all, or are you kind of in your mind, quietly, to yourself, communicating with them? How's that? 

[00:22:37] Marie: I'm doing it all remotely. 

[00:22:38] Jill: Oh, okay. All 

[00:22:39] Marie: my karma works in remote. So I go into a really, really deep, deep theta state.

[00:22:43] I connect with their higher self. I'm talking to their higher self or actually directly to their soul and asking their soul, what do you want to do? So it's a lot different than the normal work that I would do. It's a, it's a special case because if someone has the ability to speak, I'm not going to go over their head to their higher self.

[00:23:00] That's kind of rude. 

[00:23:01] Jill: Yeah, yeah, that makes sense. Is it ever the case where when you're doing this work, especially if it's with somebody that's maybe like in a coma, so you're really going over their body and you're going into the higher, like, kind of state of consciousness. Do you ever. come across other people that maybe you were like, wait, you're not who I was trying to reach.

[00:23:25] I was trying to reach this person, but I reached you instead. Does that ever happen? 

[00:23:30] Marie: No, that's a good question. But no, not yet. I always am led to the person that I'm supposed to talk to. Even when I do mediumship, which I don't always advertise, but if I'm going to talk with someone's ancestor, they always come.

[00:23:42] It's never been the wrong person. 

[00:23:44] Jill: And there's never been anybody that Tried to scare you or harm you or do anything like that. 

[00:23:50] Marie: Not on working with clients. I mean, there's some more San Diego stories, but honestly, once I learned how to connect with source and clear away anything that doesn't belong, all of that stopped.

[00:24:01] So I actually am pretty fearless when it comes to working with people. I'm not afraid of bringing anything back or getting attacked or just because I know that when I'm working with creator and I'm in the right zone, I'm safe. 

[00:24:14] Jill: That makes me happy. You should know that you feel safe and that you are safe.

[00:24:17] Is that something that any of us could learn to do or do you think that something happened because of your near death experience that put you in a different place? 

[00:24:26] Marie: I honestly, anybody can learn it because I also teach these things too. I did have a huge advantage with my experiences. I had a huge head start on this.

[00:24:34] A lot of things are super easy for me. Because there's other people who also teach the same things I teach who don't have that good relationship with the fourth planet are still afraid of ghosts. So I did have some beautiful advantages, but I do think that anybody can learn. It'll take some people longer than others.

[00:24:51] Jill: Yeah. Yeah. And if you want to learn, I guess that's where I don't think I would even want to because I feel like there's part of me. I think that's just the Catholic part of me. You know, I grew up Catholic. I think there's still that Catholic fear in there of the exorcist. God forbid that movie scared me when I was a kid.

[00:25:08] Well, 

[00:25:09] Marie: same here, but I might've been a different flavor of Catholic. My mom was a nun. for Intel Vatican Review and there weren't the reforms she wanted. So she left, met this hot biker, and now I exist. She also taught my catechism from a very different viewpoint. Her theology and her brand of Catholicism, I think, was a little bit different.

[00:25:28] I think I was lucky in that. 

[00:25:29] Jill: Yeah, that's really interesting. So your mom was a nun? Yeah. Wow. That must have been an interesting education in Catholicism. The teachings of the Bible and Catholicism and all that. 

[00:25:41] Marie: Well, her home church as a kid too, my grandmother had this reputation. Her mom had this reputation where if you have Margaret pray for you, you will be healed.

[00:25:49] So this mysticism around my grandma that she was sort of like acknowledged within the Catholic church as being a little bit more magical than others. Like her prayers carried a little bit more weight with God. 

[00:26:00] Jill: It's a family thing. It runs in your family. 

[00:26:03] Marie: Yeah. So it's a really beautiful lineage, too. And also, I'm really grateful for my mother's abundant faith that she had, because she eventually became a Methodist minister and an Episcopalian lay preacher.

[00:26:14] Because in order to do this work, you don't have to be Catholic or any of these things, but there is. The one prerequisite to have faith in something greater than you, whatever the name is. 

[00:26:25] Jill: I almost like the idea, when I read tarot cards for people, and sometimes people get really anxious. about it. And I'm like, look, there's nothing really special about me.

[00:26:36] Right? I memorized the cards. I know what the cards mean. And what I try to explain it as is you can call it God. You can call it the universe. You could call it whatever you want to. I just open myself up for whatever that is to come through and to connect with you. And so you hear what you need to hear, right?

[00:26:55] It's not me. Believe me, it's something greater than me. But I just allow myself to kind of, and that's why again, it's weird, like that doesn't scare me. But yeah, if a ghost was in my room, I might pass out. 

[00:27:07] Marie: A lot of people, there, there is something also historically kind of frightening about the unknown and everything coming from the fourth plane, which is where ghosts reside.

[00:27:16] You know, there, yeah, it's, it's, we're also, we also don't, Especially in the U. S., we don't have a good education. Culturally, in other places, they have a really good relationship with ancestors and ghosts, but for some reason, part of the collective conscience is this fear of them. 

[00:27:30] Jill: There's definitely been fear in a lot of us around ghosts and spirits.

[00:27:35] And that's the thing, though, that I find interesting about our culture. In some ways, we're obsessed with ghosts and spirits and zombies and all these, like, things. But yet, at the same time, we're terrified of it. We don't want to talk about our own death. We don't want to talk about our loved one's death.

[00:27:52] We don't want to face our own grief. We're obsessed, but we're also so scared of it that we don't really want to face it. We're in this weird place. I don't Get that. 

[00:28:02] Marie: I don't remember anyone ever having conversations with me growing up about how to grieve. And I'm actually was reflecting, I just went through a period of grief in the last month or so.

[00:28:12] Like I'm really proud of how I learned how I am in grief and how to move through it. But that was basically a skill I had to learn as opposed to something that we should be talking about and moving through. Yeah. 

[00:28:23] Jill: Mm hmm. Yeah, going back to this idea of we hold these things in our body, and we don't work through this grief, we're going to hold it in our body, and then it's going to lead to things that are not good for us.

[00:28:36] I like to use movement with my clients because I feel like that's a, gentle way for people and it's not super woo, right? Some people get a little bit like, I don't know about this woo stuff where I'm like, no, no, no, you're just moving your body. But if you're holding the grief and it's in your chest, like traditional Chinese medicine, or even the chakra system, the grief is held in your chest area.

[00:29:00] And so if we're doing things that we're just moving the body. We're just hopefully moving it out, moving it around a little bit so it's easier for us to get it out. If it helps people and they feel better in the long run, whatever. It doesn't really matter if it really is that there was something stored there or they're just feeling better because they move their body.

[00:29:18] Exactly. Yeah. And it doesn't always matter that people don't have to understand the why. But unfortunately, because I think humans, we, we like, but I need to know, I need to understand. And like, maybe eventually. And this is the thing that I've tried to talk about because my husband's very not believing in, like, any of this stuff.

[00:29:40] It's fine, right? He could be there. And because he is so scientific minded, sometimes when I talk about things and he's like, I don't know, it just don't even make sense. I'm like, yeah, but think back to a couple hundred years ago, or like viruses, like you mentioned viruses. Viruses are a great example where We couldn't see them, so we didn't believe it was like there was all these other explanations as to why people were getting sick, right?

[00:30:06] But now, we are able to see them, and we're able to know that's the reason people are getting sick. So, maybe in a few hundred years, There'll be ways to see the spirit world that we can't see now. And again, I don't know if I want to see, like maybe my room is full of people right now. I don't really know if I want to know that.

[00:30:27] But at the same time, it would I think make other people really be like, Oh, okay. So it really is there now because I could prove it by using science. Maybe we will get there eventually. We're just not there yet. We won't get there. And maybe we won't. And that's okay too. I hope that when I die, I will. I don't know for sure some of the answers to the questions that I have, just because I love to think about the things and I love to talk about them, but I really have no definite answers about anything.

[00:30:58] Even now I'm at the point where I don't question reality, like I'm not like losing my mind questioning reality, but I've heard enough things to really make me think. Okay, maybe none of this stuff really actually is real. Like, right? Like, maybe none of it is real. I hope when I die I get the answers. But then, I don't know, maybe I'll just have more questions die.

[00:31:20] I don't know. 

[00:31:20] Marie: Well, what I've been shown as I've followed people from, from life into the next plane is like, the first thing that happens is there's like a huge clearing. Because my dad was very opinionated. And it's really cool to watch that softening happen and a little bit more compassion come in. You still have a chance to grow and you get answers because you're outside of this, this third plane or this human reality.

[00:31:39] And the other beautiful thing is when you're in that other place, you're also outside time because time is sort of like a human thing. Does that make sense? Like we experience time in our human bodies, but when we're outside of it, we don't, which means you can spend as much time as a spirit with your family as you want before you move on to the next thing, because you're not worried about time anymore.

[00:31:59] It's no longer unlimited, which gets really fun because also if you're in a place outside of time, technically, You can follow your kids all the way through to the end of their time, and you can already have been reincarnated, if you believe in that. I love the concept of time on the fourth plane. Which also means that all of your future and past versions of yourself could theoretically all be there.

[00:32:21] Sometimes I might have parties with them where we get together and talk. 

[00:32:24] Jill: Yeah, that's so cool. I've said that to my daughter where she's 10 and, you know, around like probably the age of eight or nine. I think that's when kids are really starting to understand that people will die and that's going to be forever and they're going to be gone.

[00:32:38] She started feeling really sad about the fact that I'm going to die one day. And then it got to the fact of like, why did I have to wait to have her until I was so old? Cause I was 35. And I was like, what? I'm not that old. But in her mind, it just means I'm going to die sooner because I was older when I had her.

[00:32:56] And I was like, Oh, okay. I'm sorry. That makes sense. You wouldn't be you if I would have had you earlier. And I did tell her that one day I was like, well, look, I was like, how about this? I was like, possible at all. I will stick around with you for the rest of your life. I'm going to have nowhere else to go.

[00:33:10] Right. And I feel like if I do have all of this eternity, Her little puny human life, that's not gonna be that long, it's gonna be like a blink of an eye for me when I'm dead. So, I'll stick around with you forever. Until you die. And maybe I'll stick around for the grandkids if there is any, just for fun.

[00:33:25] Like, I don't know, why not? But I have recently heard this idea that we can reincarnate and be in two bodies at the same time in this. Like, which is really mind blowing to me, because I'm like, how could I be experiencing two different things in the same time period, but not knowing both of them? But of course, also, if there is past lives, I don't remember any of it anyway, thank God, because that would be very overwhelming to my little human body.

[00:33:53] Marie: I mean, also just to take that one step further, since you are going to a place that is outside of time, your next life could be a hundred years ago. You can enter the time stream anywhere, theoretically. Could be a better Past lives are not linear. 

[00:34:08] Jill: Which it means that it is literally all happening all at one time.

[00:34:12] Yep. Everything is existing all at once, all possibilities, all everything, and so maybe that means we are all really just God in little bodies moving around. 

[00:34:24] Marie: That was one of the most beautiful things that my ex nun mother taught me in catechism was this idea that God is in every molecule. Every single thing that God is ever present, which was a really cool thing to get implanted in your brain when you're seven.

[00:34:36] Jill: Unfortunately for a lot of us fully grow up Catholic, that is not what we're taught. We learn all the shame and the guilt and the fear and all the other stuff and that God's this old man in the clouds that's gonna judge us for everything that we do wrong. That's what I got out of my Catholic upbringing, unfortunately.

[00:34:52] Marie: I think that's when I started running away to a different church. I only joined the Methodist. I have friends. 

[00:34:57] Jill: I've been to a couple different Methodist churches. At this point, I love a lot of different religions, and I enjoy a lot of different religions. I took my refuge vow for being Buddhist, but that was partially just because it was like, look, Jill, you need to focus on one thing for a while.

[00:35:13] It's all going to take you to the same place, you need to stop bouncing all over. I still enjoy a lot of different things from different religions, and I try to learn about all of them as much as I can, just because I love to learn. I think learning is fun, actually. 

[00:35:27] Marie: Learn human. And for me, religion comes down to what kind of community do you want to be in?

[00:35:31] Jill: Yeah, when you take refuge, Val, you take refuge in the Buddha and the Sangha, which is the community, right? And so you're taking refuge in that community and the teachings of Buddha and Buddha's look, man, I'm just like you. You could do this if I did it. Nothing special about me because I enjoy it. But I do.

[00:35:49] I think it's because I found a community. I really enjoyed. I'm kind of jumping into that community. And now we're doing a death and dying manual, which I'm really excited about. And I'm going to do the training to do Buddhist funerals. This is where I feel like it's my community and I can serve. People in this way.

[00:36:08] Oh yeah. We're almost out of time. It went by so fast. And so you do work with people. They don't have to be local to you. You work with people virtually. Tell me about your work and if people want to reach you. I'll put links in the show notes. Just tell us where we can reach you, where we can find you and what you can do with us.

[00:36:27] Okay. 

[00:36:27] Marie: Well, my business name is House of Kellen of the K, which is named after my great grandmother. Super powerful lady. I do individual sessions one on one. I help people find their soulmates. I do medical medium work. And these are just through Zoom, usually an hour at a time. I also teach people how to become Theta Healing Practitioners.

[00:36:45] Jill: The And so if I put the link to your website, people can find all your information about your different work and programs and stuff like that. 

[00:36:54] Marie: Absolutely. I try to keep the website up to date. Lots of things you can click on and explore on it. 

[00:36:58] Jill: Wonderful. Yeah. And I will put links in there so people can find you.

[00:37:03] This is awesome. This is so interesting. Thank you so much for taking time to talk to me today and letting me ask you all kinds of crazy questions. I love to learn. I love to have these conversations. And if anything, I tend to have more questions than answers, but I like that too. Wonderful. Thank you so much 

[00:37:20] Marie: for having me.

[00:37:20] This was 

[00:37:21] Jill: a pleasure. Thank you for listening to this episode of seeing death clearly. In my next episode, I talked to Brandon Zimmerman about the history and challenges of Mount Vernon Cemetery, a hidden gem in northern Philadelphia. Established in 1856, this 28 acre cemetery With over 33, 000 graves has faced decades of neglect and decline.

[00:37:46] Brandon shares how the cemetery transitioned from a historical landmark to an overgrown haven for wildlife with deer, foxes, and even great horned owls. thriving amidst invasive vegetation. He discusses the cemetery's potential to serve as a green space for the surrounding neighborhood, blending restoration efforts with ecological preservation.

[00:38:09] Join us for this conversation about history, ecology, and the power of community driven transformation. If you enjoyed this episode, please share it with a friend or family member who might find it helpful. your support. And spreading the podcast is greatly appreciated. Please consider subscribing on your favorite podcast platform and leaving a five star review.

[00:38:29] Your positive feedback helps recommend the podcast others. The podcast also offers a paid subscription feature that allows you to financially support the show. Your contribution will help keep the podcast advertisement free. Whether your donation is large or small, every amount is valuable. I sincerely appreciate all of you for listening to the show and supporting me in any way you can.

[00:38:49] You can find a link in the show notes to subscribe to the paid monthly subscription, as well as a link to my Venmo if you prefer to make a one time contribution. Thank you and I look forward to seeing you in next week's episode of Seeing Death Clearly.